Israel's solution is clear: expel or exterminate the Palestinians and take all their land as more Israel. This is indisputable. The filling of the WB is already too complete for the two-state solution, and Netanyahu HELPED Hamas to assure that Gaza and the WB were not united under the single leadership of the Palestinian Authority. And N…
Israel's solution is clear: expel or exterminate the Palestinians and take all their land as more Israel. This is indisputable. The filling of the WB is already too complete for the two-state solution, and Netanyahu HELPED Hamas to assure that Gaza and the WB were not united under the single leadership of the Palestinian Authority. And Netanyahu knew what they were.
1200 dead Israelis is a small cost for the expansion enabled by promoting the occupation to expanded borders. Gaza will be resettled, the WB will be completely taken, and then it's on to other nations.
Which America will meekly call "unhepful" and the money and weapons will keep coming.
Chris, can we calm down the rhetoric just a bit, among ourselves? I will try as well.
Let's stick to Gaza for the moment. Israel removed all settlements in 2005 (which were never very extensive). The population of Gaza has more than doubled since then. Israel has supplied water and electricity, and treatment of serious medical conditions is often done in Israel. There is a LOT to criticize about Israel's policies towards Gaza, but I have seen zero evidence that Israel is trying to reduce the population of Gaza, much less expel or exterminate them.
What convinces you that Israel is "indisputably" attempting to expel or exterminate the population of Gaza? Please, no yelling or insults, but a link to some factual article supporting your opinion would be appreciated. I'm asking you to support your goal of "championing objective reality", and I'll read any (reasonable length and available) source which supports that opinion.
I do think that the conservative coalition behind Netanyahu desires to take over most of the West Bank, and I think that's a terrible injustice, which many (but not enough) Israelis oppose. I'm asking for clarification about your assertion about Gaza, tho, not about the West Bank.
One problem in the area is that there are two fast growing populations: culturally conservative Palestinians (most of them), and culturally conservative Israelis (now a majority of Israel), both of which tend to have large families.
(True in the US as well; conservatives have larger families on average than modern liberals - but more pronounced in Israel since many of the more conservative parts of the Israeli population come from quite different nations and cultures than the more liberal parts do).
In Israel, this demographic shift is favoring the right side of the spectrum in democratic elections, alas. Israeli citizens whose families migrated from Arabic or Islamic nations tend to be more aggressive in their treatment of Palestinians - and they have no dual citizenship to allow them to happily return to the US or Europe if Israel fails. They have less (if any) faith in a solution of peaceful co-existence, largely due to their own experiences. Meanwhile, generations of Palestinians are growing up with understandable hatred of Israel. It's definitely a tragedy, with no easy solutions.
I think it’s abundantly clear that they are taking all of Gaza, presumably to be resettled, but several spokesmen have said that all Palestinians must leave.
Could you provide a link? In my research of the many, many points from both sides, I have never come across a spokesman for Israel who advocated for Israel even to 'eventually' take over and settle "all of Gaza" after forcing all Palestinians to leave, much less that they are doing so in present tense, but if you can provide some solid evidence that might shift my perspective. I'm astounded that I've never seen even the harsh critics of Israel document such a point, but you may be more familiar with the objective sources so I'm open to one or more links supporting your opinion.
OK, so your morning newsfeed included an Israeli spokesman who said that all Palestinians must leave Gaza, and further that the (2-2.5million) residents there should be divided into groups of 20-50K going to each Arab nation?
I'd really appreciate a link to that, so we can cooperatively verify the objective factuality of it. I assume you know where you get your morning newsfeed from, and the time and day you heard that.
But you have said that "several spokesmen" for Israel have stated that all Gazans must leave, so you could provide links to some of the other spokemen's words instead if that's easier.
I'm wondering about their exact words, and their credentials to speak on behalf of the Israeli government.
You aren't calling me a liar so I am not responding as though defending against such a charge.
However these statements came from reputable news sources, not nutcases on social media. And while Israel routinely suppresses news even after publication, I'm sure these are still extant.
Respectfully, however, I am not going to seek out links. You could do the same with exactly the same amount of effort, and since I already read them, it's you who needs to.
Not that there is any reason to doubt. Expansionism is Israel's 𝑟𝑎𝑖𝑠𝑜𝑛 𝑑'𝑒̂𝑡𝑟𝑒, which is why they are filling the West Bank with "settlements" to make sure Palestinians never again have their own state.
First, they said to evacuate northern Gaza, now they are leveling the south as well, and, yes, they are saying everyone needs to leave, and, no,. they will not leave it empty.
I never credit news from dubious sources and that even includes, in this instance, the Gray Lady. I typically read the Washington Post and Associated Press as I sip my morning coffee. In this affair the NYT has too pronounced a pro-Israel slant and I don't take them seriously there.
I do recommend Al Jazeera. Their avoidance of bias is impressive and they are much more textual than pictorial. But they'tr occasional reading for me, something I should change.
Israel's solution is clear: expel or exterminate the Palestinians and take all their land as more Israel. This is indisputable. The filling of the WB is already too complete for the two-state solution, and Netanyahu HELPED Hamas to assure that Gaza and the WB were not united under the single leadership of the Palestinian Authority. And Netanyahu knew what they were.
1200 dead Israelis is a small cost for the expansion enabled by promoting the occupation to expanded borders. Gaza will be resettled, the WB will be completely taken, and then it's on to other nations.
Which America will meekly call "unhepful" and the money and weapons will keep coming.
Chris, can we calm down the rhetoric just a bit, among ourselves? I will try as well.
Let's stick to Gaza for the moment. Israel removed all settlements in 2005 (which were never very extensive). The population of Gaza has more than doubled since then. Israel has supplied water and electricity, and treatment of serious medical conditions is often done in Israel. There is a LOT to criticize about Israel's policies towards Gaza, but I have seen zero evidence that Israel is trying to reduce the population of Gaza, much less expel or exterminate them.
What convinces you that Israel is "indisputably" attempting to expel or exterminate the population of Gaza? Please, no yelling or insults, but a link to some factual article supporting your opinion would be appreciated. I'm asking you to support your goal of "championing objective reality", and I'll read any (reasonable length and available) source which supports that opinion.
I do think that the conservative coalition behind Netanyahu desires to take over most of the West Bank, and I think that's a terrible injustice, which many (but not enough) Israelis oppose. I'm asking for clarification about your assertion about Gaza, tho, not about the West Bank.
One problem in the area is that there are two fast growing populations: culturally conservative Palestinians (most of them), and culturally conservative Israelis (now a majority of Israel), both of which tend to have large families.
(True in the US as well; conservatives have larger families on average than modern liberals - but more pronounced in Israel since many of the more conservative parts of the Israeli population come from quite different nations and cultures than the more liberal parts do).
In Israel, this demographic shift is favoring the right side of the spectrum in democratic elections, alas. Israeli citizens whose families migrated from Arabic or Islamic nations tend to be more aggressive in their treatment of Palestinians - and they have no dual citizenship to allow them to happily return to the US or Europe if Israel fails. They have less (if any) faith in a solution of peaceful co-existence, largely due to their own experiences. Meanwhile, generations of Palestinians are growing up with understandable hatred of Israel. It's definitely a tragedy, with no easy solutions.
I think it’s abundantly clear that they are taking all of Gaza, presumably to be resettled, but several spokesmen have said that all Palestinians must leave.
Could you provide a link? In my research of the many, many points from both sides, I have never come across a spokesman for Israel who advocated for Israel even to 'eventually' take over and settle "all of Gaza" after forcing all Palestinians to leave, much less that they are doing so in present tense, but if you can provide some solid evidence that might shift my perspective. I'm astounded that I've never seen even the harsh critics of Israel document such a point, but you may be more familiar with the objective sources so I'm open to one or more links supporting your opinion.
One was talking about each Arab nation taking 20-50,000. On my morning news feed.
OK, so your morning newsfeed included an Israeli spokesman who said that all Palestinians must leave Gaza, and further that the (2-2.5million) residents there should be divided into groups of 20-50K going to each Arab nation?
I'd really appreciate a link to that, so we can cooperatively verify the objective factuality of it. I assume you know where you get your morning newsfeed from, and the time and day you heard that.
But you have said that "several spokesmen" for Israel have stated that all Gazans must leave, so you could provide links to some of the other spokemen's words instead if that's easier.
I'm wondering about their exact words, and their credentials to speak on behalf of the Israeli government.
You aren't calling me a liar so I am not responding as though defending against such a charge.
However these statements came from reputable news sources, not nutcases on social media. And while Israel routinely suppresses news even after publication, I'm sure these are still extant.
Respectfully, however, I am not going to seek out links. You could do the same with exactly the same amount of effort, and since I already read them, it's you who needs to.
Not that there is any reason to doubt. Expansionism is Israel's 𝑟𝑎𝑖𝑠𝑜𝑛 𝑑'𝑒̂𝑡𝑟𝑒, which is why they are filling the West Bank with "settlements" to make sure Palestinians never again have their own state.
First, they said to evacuate northern Gaza, now they are leveling the south as well, and, yes, they are saying everyone needs to leave, and, no,. they will not leave it empty.
I never credit news from dubious sources and that even includes, in this instance, the Gray Lady. I typically read the Washington Post and Associated Press as I sip my morning coffee. In this affair the NYT has too pronounced a pro-Israel slant and I don't take them seriously there.
I do recommend Al Jazeera. Their avoidance of bias is impressive and they are much more textual than pictorial. But they'tr occasional reading for me, something I should change.