I can't quickly think of a joke that is not at someone's or something's expense. It stands to reason that someone will find that offensive and others from the same group will think it funny. When my wife first heard bad Asian drivers called DWO (driving while oriental) she laughed like when she discovered the Three Stooges (she was cackl…
I can't quickly think of a joke that is not at someone's or something's expense. It stands to reason that someone will find that offensive and others from the same group will think it funny. When my wife first heard bad Asian drivers called DWO (driving while oriental) she laughed like when she discovered the Three Stooges (she was cackling). I'm sure that is offensive to someone.
The thing is, I've heard the best blond jokes from blonds and back in the day when white people didn't think themselves the same, Polock jokes from Polish people, etc. The offended are most likely to loudly speak, creating the impression that they are the official spokespersons for their group.
When a friend, a black man, said, "You know how I can tell when y'all are telling a n****r joke? He quickly turned his head to look over one shoulder and then the other. TRUTH in 1980 Georgia. Some wouldn't find it funny when they saw and knew it, but he knew I'd laugh "with him" without malice.
Trans people do have a special problem. Even with it's horrible history, it was easier for most white people to accept the basic humanity of black people and do their best to shed racist thought than to see transgenders as something understandable. We may do our best to be polite and accommodating but will we ever deep down believe that a person with functional overlies, and uterus who has a baby is a man having a baby? Trans people know that and it may have something to do with their aversion to jokes about it, knowing that many people think them a joke. And to be honest, I think that is pretty damned horrible. I wish it was not that way, but I think it is.
No matter what you do, you are offensive to someone. Killing off comedy and jokes won't fix that.
"Trans people know that and it may have something to do with their aversion to jokes about it, knowing that many people think them a joke."
Yeah, I think this is very true. I mean, the very nature of gender dysphoria is that you know that people see you in a way you don't see (or feel) yourself. I think there's so much talk about affirmation and validation in the trans community precisely because the final piece of easing that dysphoria is having everybody affirms the feelings they have about themselves. Hence Dave's question:
"To what extent do I have to participate in your self-image?"
Transgender identity, unlike any other, requires participation. It's not good enough for everybody to live and let live. You now need to say "he" when your eyes tell you "she". You need to re-address biological facts that have been 99.98% settled for the whole of human history. This is the root of the problem I think. And why the trans community doesn't have much of a sense of humour about themselves.
But this is the problem. I don't think most people have an issue with using the pronouns that others prefer. It's a pretty simple level of politeness. But asking women to share private spaces with or compete against male-bodied people? Yeah, that's a little more complex, because it's not simply about politeness anymore. Here, discussion and compromise is needed. And to have those discussions, we need to be honest about certain realities. Even if those realities don't always feel super affirming.
I can't quickly think of a joke that is not at someone's or something's expense. It stands to reason that someone will find that offensive and others from the same group will think it funny. When my wife first heard bad Asian drivers called DWO (driving while oriental) she laughed like when she discovered the Three Stooges (she was cackling). I'm sure that is offensive to someone.
The thing is, I've heard the best blond jokes from blonds and back in the day when white people didn't think themselves the same, Polock jokes from Polish people, etc. The offended are most likely to loudly speak, creating the impression that they are the official spokespersons for their group.
When a friend, a black man, said, "You know how I can tell when y'all are telling a n****r joke? He quickly turned his head to look over one shoulder and then the other. TRUTH in 1980 Georgia. Some wouldn't find it funny when they saw and knew it, but he knew I'd laugh "with him" without malice.
Trans people do have a special problem. Even with it's horrible history, it was easier for most white people to accept the basic humanity of black people and do their best to shed racist thought than to see transgenders as something understandable. We may do our best to be polite and accommodating but will we ever deep down believe that a person with functional overlies, and uterus who has a baby is a man having a baby? Trans people know that and it may have something to do with their aversion to jokes about it, knowing that many people think them a joke. And to be honest, I think that is pretty damned horrible. I wish it was not that way, but I think it is.
No matter what you do, you are offensive to someone. Killing off comedy and jokes won't fix that.
"Trans people know that and it may have something to do with their aversion to jokes about it, knowing that many people think them a joke."
Yeah, I think this is very true. I mean, the very nature of gender dysphoria is that you know that people see you in a way you don't see (or feel) yourself. I think there's so much talk about affirmation and validation in the trans community precisely because the final piece of easing that dysphoria is having everybody affirms the feelings they have about themselves. Hence Dave's question:
"To what extent do I have to participate in your self-image?"
Transgender identity, unlike any other, requires participation. It's not good enough for everybody to live and let live. You now need to say "he" when your eyes tell you "she". You need to re-address biological facts that have been 99.98% settled for the whole of human history. This is the root of the problem I think. And why the trans community doesn't have much of a sense of humour about themselves.
But this is the problem. I don't think most people have an issue with using the pronouns that others prefer. It's a pretty simple level of politeness. But asking women to share private spaces with or compete against male-bodied people? Yeah, that's a little more complex, because it's not simply about politeness anymore. Here, discussion and compromise is needed. And to have those discussions, we need to be honest about certain realities. Even if those realities don't always feel super affirming.