I read McWhorter's Woke Racism and had mixed feelings. A lot that I liked and enough that I didn't like to give it a so-so rating. One of the things I really didn't care for in that book was the idea that the infernal Woke are too far gone to even try to sway. McWhorter comes from the stance that they are lost and so trying to debate the…
I read McWhorter's Woke Racism and had mixed feelings. A lot that I liked and enough that I didn't like to give it a so-so rating. One of the things I really didn't care for in that book was the idea that the infernal Woke are too far gone to even try to sway. McWhorter comes from the stance that they are lost and so trying to debate them would be to channel Sissyphus rolling that rock uphill. I thought that was a really binary thing of McWhorter to say and disagreed wholeheartedly. Maybe this was my inner humanist reacting. Who is really, truly "lost" anyway?
Well, I think now I get where he was coming from. J seems not just very, very lost but also unable to even have a good faith exchange of ideas. And my God, the smug complacency & entitlement just oozes off of each their responses. It's simultaneously frustrating, disturbing, and disgusting to see. Debating with him is like staring into the abyss but the abyss isn't staring back, it's trying to suck you in.
"One of the things I really didn't care for in that book was the idea that the infernal Woke are too far gone to even try to sway. McWhorter comes from the stance that they are lost and so trying to debate them would be to channel Sissyphus rolling that rock uphill."
Yeah, I'm torn on this point. I have a lot of faith in human beings, so I don't ever think they're hopeless (or at least not when they're just at the "making silly arguments on the internet" phase). I also understand that in most cases, it's not that people can't think, it's that the ideology they've bought into (and there are many), offers them something that objective reality doesn't. So they cling to it, in the face of all logic and evidence to the contrary.
I've spent a lot of time talking to J over the past few months. He derives a lot of his sense of self from this notion of oppression and struggle. That's hard to convince people to let go of, even though I'm absolutely certain he'd be happier if he did. But I've also seen many people who *do* eventually let go of it. Or at least loosen their grip.
J, believe it or not, is less insufferable than when we first started talking. As Passion pointed out, I was more sarcastic than I'd normally allow myself to be, because we've gone around enough times that we *both* know his arguments are hollow.
What he needs now, and what everybody needs when they're shaking off an old ideology, is a better way to think about the world.Something that allows them to function as well as before, without the burden of clinging to what they know full well are lies. Which is why he keeps coming back to my comments with some new nugget of Kendi-ism to debunk.
The abyss is within J. And what's staring back is reality. I don't know if he'll find the courage to look at it. But in his own way, I think he's actually trying. I'm just unlucky enough to be the person he's chosen to help him.😅
You are doing good work then - and you certainly have much more patience than I could ever imagine having! I'm glad that they may not be the extremely extreme case that I was seeing in their responses.
And I agree with you re. how people can truly let go of such things. I've seen it at my agency's volunteer trainings, where the ideology & values espoused are liberal-humanist rather than reactionary-woke.
"And my God, the smug complacency & entitlement just oozes off of each their responses. It's simultaneously frustrating, disturbing, and disgusting to see."
Couldn't help but notice this myself.
"Debating with him is like staring into the abyss but the abyss isn't staring back, it's trying to suck you in."
I'll hafta use this line, it was *that* good! TY for Your comment, Sir.
Oh! Thanking Steve for the article. That goes without saying, but I sometimes forget to say it.
I read McWhorter's Woke Racism and had mixed feelings. A lot that I liked and enough that I didn't like to give it a so-so rating. One of the things I really didn't care for in that book was the idea that the infernal Woke are too far gone to even try to sway. McWhorter comes from the stance that they are lost and so trying to debate them would be to channel Sissyphus rolling that rock uphill. I thought that was a really binary thing of McWhorter to say and disagreed wholeheartedly. Maybe this was my inner humanist reacting. Who is really, truly "lost" anyway?
Well, I think now I get where he was coming from. J seems not just very, very lost but also unable to even have a good faith exchange of ideas. And my God, the smug complacency & entitlement just oozes off of each their responses. It's simultaneously frustrating, disturbing, and disgusting to see. Debating with him is like staring into the abyss but the abyss isn't staring back, it's trying to suck you in.
"One of the things I really didn't care for in that book was the idea that the infernal Woke are too far gone to even try to sway. McWhorter comes from the stance that they are lost and so trying to debate them would be to channel Sissyphus rolling that rock uphill."
Yeah, I'm torn on this point. I have a lot of faith in human beings, so I don't ever think they're hopeless (or at least not when they're just at the "making silly arguments on the internet" phase). I also understand that in most cases, it's not that people can't think, it's that the ideology they've bought into (and there are many), offers them something that objective reality doesn't. So they cling to it, in the face of all logic and evidence to the contrary.
I've spent a lot of time talking to J over the past few months. He derives a lot of his sense of self from this notion of oppression and struggle. That's hard to convince people to let go of, even though I'm absolutely certain he'd be happier if he did. But I've also seen many people who *do* eventually let go of it. Or at least loosen their grip.
J, believe it or not, is less insufferable than when we first started talking. As Passion pointed out, I was more sarcastic than I'd normally allow myself to be, because we've gone around enough times that we *both* know his arguments are hollow.
What he needs now, and what everybody needs when they're shaking off an old ideology, is a better way to think about the world.Something that allows them to function as well as before, without the burden of clinging to what they know full well are lies. Which is why he keeps coming back to my comments with some new nugget of Kendi-ism to debunk.
The abyss is within J. And what's staring back is reality. I don't know if he'll find the courage to look at it. But in his own way, I think he's actually trying. I'm just unlucky enough to be the person he's chosen to help him.😅
You are doing good work then - and you certainly have much more patience than I could ever imagine having! I'm glad that they may not be the extremely extreme case that I was seeing in their responses.
And I agree with you re. how people can truly let go of such things. I've seen it at my agency's volunteer trainings, where the ideology & values espoused are liberal-humanist rather than reactionary-woke.
All Your points are well-taken, M. Monday.
"And my God, the smug complacency & entitlement just oozes off of each their responses. It's simultaneously frustrating, disturbing, and disgusting to see."
Couldn't help but notice this myself.
"Debating with him is like staring into the abyss but the abyss isn't staring back, it's trying to suck you in."
I'll hafta use this line, it was *that* good! TY for Your comment, Sir.
Oh! Thanking Steve for the article. That goes without saying, but I sometimes forget to say it.