I seems to me when people speak of identity in 2022, they really mean 'tribe'
Of course one never perfectly aligns in all ways with others in your tribe, but you align enough that you can band together, you have enough vested interests in common things that it makes sense to have loyalty to each other. I understand that you think we woul…
I seems to me when people speak of identity in 2022, they really mean 'tribe'
Of course one never perfectly aligns in all ways with others in your tribe, but you align enough that you can band together, you have enough vested interests in common things that it makes sense to have loyalty to each other. I understand that you think we would all be better off not trying to form strong tribes, still I think we need to recognize that desire to form tribes is deeply hardwired into our genes and culture. Those w/o strong tribal associations are often at great risk from strong tribes (there is strength in numbers).
From an evolutionary point of view it does not matter as much what you select for tribal affiliation as it does that you DO select an affiliation, and you arrange for that tribe to defend you when needed.
Given how central sexuality is within human culture and human existence, it is not surprising to me that those who feel traditional sexual roles are a bad fit, also decide this particular aspect of themselves (as opposed to the many other aspects of themselves) is **THE** defining aspect of themselves. Whereas for me, I identify pretty well with standard male sexual role, so then the whole thing becomes much less salient for me. Yes I am a guy, but so are 40+% of all other humans thus it is not a very special thing for me.
Anyway, I am just explaining (to myself anyway), why a non-binary person would latch onto that label as being their defining label. you asked the difference between your feeling of mixture of male and female and the feeling a non-binary person feels. Well I cannot know, but certainly one massive difference is that while you and I do clearly feel both male and female in certain ways, we DONT feel that our feelings are very different from other males... we don't feel DIFFERENT because of this. The non-binary person DOES feel their feelings ARE different. It is a feeling that not just that maleness or femaleness does not fit. But that they whole experience they are having is qualitatively different from that of other males/females.
You and I don't feel that way. We both know our experience is unique... but it is unique just like all other males are unique... we see ourselves as still within the same distribution... if we think of it in statistical terms. For the non-binary, they feel they are not part of the same distribution.
Of course I am not non-binary, so maybe I am all wet.
"From an evolutionary point of view it does not matter as much what you select for tribal affiliation as it does that you DO select an affiliation, and you arrange for that tribe to defend you when needed."
Yeah, this is an interesting point. Dave Murray shared a fascinating video about tribalism recently (https://youtu.be/agNwB5xR9H4). And the speaker makes the same point about needing a tribe for defence. But I'd argue that our modern "tribes"don't do that. Group membership is earned by conforming to the ideology (which very often includes certain lies) of the group. If you fail to do that, or even fail to do it enthusiastically enough, the group turns on you.
Trumpism, gender ideology, even the various factions that formed during COVID, it's like we've taken on the worst aspects of tribalism whilst simultaneously losing the only benefits!
I seems to me when people speak of identity in 2022, they really mean 'tribe'
Of course one never perfectly aligns in all ways with others in your tribe, but you align enough that you can band together, you have enough vested interests in common things that it makes sense to have loyalty to each other. I understand that you think we would all be better off not trying to form strong tribes, still I think we need to recognize that desire to form tribes is deeply hardwired into our genes and culture. Those w/o strong tribal associations are often at great risk from strong tribes (there is strength in numbers).
From an evolutionary point of view it does not matter as much what you select for tribal affiliation as it does that you DO select an affiliation, and you arrange for that tribe to defend you when needed.
Given how central sexuality is within human culture and human existence, it is not surprising to me that those who feel traditional sexual roles are a bad fit, also decide this particular aspect of themselves (as opposed to the many other aspects of themselves) is **THE** defining aspect of themselves. Whereas for me, I identify pretty well with standard male sexual role, so then the whole thing becomes much less salient for me. Yes I am a guy, but so are 40+% of all other humans thus it is not a very special thing for me.
Anyway, I am just explaining (to myself anyway), why a non-binary person would latch onto that label as being their defining label. you asked the difference between your feeling of mixture of male and female and the feeling a non-binary person feels. Well I cannot know, but certainly one massive difference is that while you and I do clearly feel both male and female in certain ways, we DONT feel that our feelings are very different from other males... we don't feel DIFFERENT because of this. The non-binary person DOES feel their feelings ARE different. It is a feeling that not just that maleness or femaleness does not fit. But that they whole experience they are having is qualitatively different from that of other males/females.
You and I don't feel that way. We both know our experience is unique... but it is unique just like all other males are unique... we see ourselves as still within the same distribution... if we think of it in statistical terms. For the non-binary, they feel they are not part of the same distribution.
Of course I am not non-binary, so maybe I am all wet.
"From an evolutionary point of view it does not matter as much what you select for tribal affiliation as it does that you DO select an affiliation, and you arrange for that tribe to defend you when needed."
Yeah, this is an interesting point. Dave Murray shared a fascinating video about tribalism recently (https://youtu.be/agNwB5xR9H4). And the speaker makes the same point about needing a tribe for defence. But I'd argue that our modern "tribes"don't do that. Group membership is earned by conforming to the ideology (which very often includes certain lies) of the group. If you fail to do that, or even fail to do it enthusiastically enough, the group turns on you.
Trumpism, gender ideology, even the various factions that formed during COVID, it's like we've taken on the worst aspects of tribalism whilst simultaneously losing the only benefits!