Here’s something you won’t know about unless it’s a part of your “lived experience”: If you’re a race writer (you may also need to be black, I’m not sure), and mention the Atlantic slave trade for any reason, somebody will come into your comments to tell you one (or all) of the following:
I'm glad that you wrote this. I am guilty of having mentioned the things you shine a light on (African complicity, age old non-race-based slavery, etc.). Yea, that does have a bad feel.
In keeping with the title of this commentary, thinking about it, it was likely an emotional response to the ubiquitous "Dear white people" articles telling me that I must acknowledge the evil of whiteness with an implicit me being evil because of my membership in the white tribe. Not explicit but obviously implicit. I'll refrain from a rant on monoliths.
Trying to not let my inner Marine speak here, I'll just say that I do get tired of that crap. <-- emotion! It's not an excuse, I'll try to hold that stuff in check in the future. Thank you.
With regard to that being aimed at you, people do tend to latch on to one small thing not in the context of the larger thing when they don't like the larger thing but have no adequate response to it. Again emotion - frustration about a valid challenge to their cherished "truth."
"it was likely an emotional response to the ubiquitous "Dear white people" articles telling me that I must acknowledge the evil of whiteness with an implicit me being evil because of my membership in the white tribe."
Absolutely. Following my own advice to understand where people are coming from, I completely see how the ubiquity of these articles blaming white people for the actions of other white people from hundreds of years ago will end up causing defensiveness. That's why I told spike not to buy into that nonsense.
*I* get frustrated reading about how all white people are forever complicit in the evils of slavery and Jim Crow. So I can only imagine how annoying it must for you.
But yeah, I don't feel as if the defensiveness is aimed at me exactly. It's just the degree and frequency of it, especially as I'm clearly *not* blaming white people of today for the sins of everybody who ever looked like them, that gets a bit grating after a while😅
I think you make a good point, Dave. It’s not a lack of empathy or even a ‘white guilt’ response, to me. It’s the feeling of essential unfairness of being tagged with baggage based on immutable characteristics and needing to call out hypocrisy to maintain personal integrity. Yet the calling out does lack empathy, which is why Steve’s comment on the ‘sweet spot’ between rational persuasion and empathy rings so true.
“ you need to be able to demonstrate not only that you're right, but also that you understand where they're coming from.”
Perfectly said. So difficult to achieve.
I know you’ve taken a ton of flack for holding to this position, Steve, particularly when you seek to understand where all people are coming from. I’ve realized some important truths that helped me process some truly awful racially-based incidents in my life by reading your thoughtful, persuasive, gentle, wry, understanding commentary. Thank you, as always, for your perseverance.
"I know you’ve taken a ton of flack for holding to this position, Steve, particularly when you seek to understand where all people are coming from."
We're taught, in so many ways, to ignore or demonise any perspective that doesn't align with ours. And, to a degree, it makes sense. Some people really are fruit loops who aren't interested in thinking or nuance.
But my ability to discuss these issues, such as it is, comes from the insights I've gained from people I disagreed with, far more than from those I agreed with. I wish more people would appreciate the value of this.
Thanks Jen, I always appreciate your input. We often agree, but your compassion always expands my view a little.
Yeah, I'm a habitual "but/however" user too, so I don't read too much into that. *But*😅 Spike definitely struck me as wanting to create controversy for controversy's sake, in discussions that were obviously going to be emotive for people. And then he can take their emotional response as proof of his greater emotional maturity.
I'm glad that you wrote this. I am guilty of having mentioned the things you shine a light on (African complicity, age old non-race-based slavery, etc.). Yea, that does have a bad feel.
In keeping with the title of this commentary, thinking about it, it was likely an emotional response to the ubiquitous "Dear white people" articles telling me that I must acknowledge the evil of whiteness with an implicit me being evil because of my membership in the white tribe. Not explicit but obviously implicit. I'll refrain from a rant on monoliths.
Trying to not let my inner Marine speak here, I'll just say that I do get tired of that crap. <-- emotion! It's not an excuse, I'll try to hold that stuff in check in the future. Thank you.
With regard to that being aimed at you, people do tend to latch on to one small thing not in the context of the larger thing when they don't like the larger thing but have no adequate response to it. Again emotion - frustration about a valid challenge to their cherished "truth."
"it was likely an emotional response to the ubiquitous "Dear white people" articles telling me that I must acknowledge the evil of whiteness with an implicit me being evil because of my membership in the white tribe."
Absolutely. Following my own advice to understand where people are coming from, I completely see how the ubiquity of these articles blaming white people for the actions of other white people from hundreds of years ago will end up causing defensiveness. That's why I told spike not to buy into that nonsense.
*I* get frustrated reading about how all white people are forever complicit in the evils of slavery and Jim Crow. So I can only imagine how annoying it must for you.
But yeah, I don't feel as if the defensiveness is aimed at me exactly. It's just the degree and frequency of it, especially as I'm clearly *not* blaming white people of today for the sins of everybody who ever looked like them, that gets a bit grating after a while😅
I think you make a good point, Dave. It’s not a lack of empathy or even a ‘white guilt’ response, to me. It’s the feeling of essential unfairness of being tagged with baggage based on immutable characteristics and needing to call out hypocrisy to maintain personal integrity. Yet the calling out does lack empathy, which is why Steve’s comment on the ‘sweet spot’ between rational persuasion and empathy rings so true.
Enjoyed your comment!
“ you need to be able to demonstrate not only that you're right, but also that you understand where they're coming from.”
Perfectly said. So difficult to achieve.
I know you’ve taken a ton of flack for holding to this position, Steve, particularly when you seek to understand where all people are coming from. I’ve realized some important truths that helped me process some truly awful racially-based incidents in my life by reading your thoughtful, persuasive, gentle, wry, understanding commentary. Thank you, as always, for your perseverance.
"I know you’ve taken a ton of flack for holding to this position, Steve, particularly when you seek to understand where all people are coming from."
We're taught, in so many ways, to ignore or demonise any perspective that doesn't align with ours. And, to a degree, it makes sense. Some people really are fruit loops who aren't interested in thinking or nuance.
But my ability to discuss these issues, such as it is, comes from the insights I've gained from people I disagreed with, far more than from those I agreed with. I wish more people would appreciate the value of this.
Thanks Jen, I always appreciate your input. We often agree, but your compassion always expands my view a little.
The fact Spike used “but” and “however,” really sealed the deal for me; It seems he was most interested in proving his point(s)
Yeah, I'm a habitual "but/however" user too, so I don't read too much into that. *But*😅 Spike definitely struck me as wanting to create controversy for controversy's sake, in discussions that were obviously going to be emotive for people. And then he can take their emotional response as proof of his greater emotional maturity.