I get what Treecy is saying and I'm reminded of a college course on social movements I took where I learned about how some civil rights orgs in the '60s finally kicked the white folks out because they were doing exactly what she complained about. I expect that was probably a good idea back in civil rights's infancy when black Americans d…
I get what Treecy is saying and I'm reminded of a college course on social movements I took where I learned about how some civil rights orgs in the '60s finally kicked the white folks out because they were doing exactly what she complained about. I expect that was probably a good idea back in civil rights's infancy when black Americans didn't have the powerful voices (like, standing up to white people) that they have now.
But yeah, I also had that familiar feeling I get when black people complain about white people the way some women complain about men not letting them speak: SPEAK THE FUCK UP!
One experience that's foreign to me is being warned that when I turned forty my opinions and ideas would no longer be valued. That in company meetings, my opinion would be less valued once I passed my 'expiry date'. Well, that day has come and gone a *long* time ago and people hear me whether they want to or not. I *make* myself heard, sometimes to the point where people have legitimate reason to tell me the STFU for a moment :)
Black folks, like women, sometimes just need to speak the fuck up more. Stop telling me about what you're not 'allowed' to do, because I don't 'allow' men to tell me what to do or say.
And yeah, it wouldn't kill folks like Treecy to consider that their own experience is not necessarily everyone else's, and she sure as shit can't read white peoples' mind (mind reading is a skill a LOT of social justice warriors of all flavours seem to think they possess, LOL).
Just as we can't know what it feels like to be black, black folks can't know what it feels like to be white, especially white people who ARE aware there's a racism problem and aren't focused on preserving their privilege at the cost of others. It's why I have some sympathy for men, including white men, who are also a bit too beaten up sometimes by by feminism. Too many people telling them they suck no matter what they do just as some blacks do to whites.
Thanks, as always, Steve, for being a voice of reason.
"I learned about how some civil rights orgs in the '60s finally kicked the white folks out because they were doing exactly what she complained about."
Ah yes, absolutely. If we were still living in 1960 I'd completely agree with Treecy. In fact, there are a lot of things that I'd see very differently. But thank God, we're not! So today, I think we need to, as you so eloquently put it, SPEAK THE FUCK UP!😄
As I said to Treecy, the idea that minorities need "permission" to speak is no good, and it's an idea that whoever the "oppressors" are, be it men or white people or straight people, aren't going to dispel. We've become very good at look outwards for people to blame, but it's past time that some people looked at themselves too.
I get what Treecy is saying and I'm reminded of a college course on social movements I took where I learned about how some civil rights orgs in the '60s finally kicked the white folks out because they were doing exactly what she complained about. I expect that was probably a good idea back in civil rights's infancy when black Americans didn't have the powerful voices (like, standing up to white people) that they have now.
But yeah, I also had that familiar feeling I get when black people complain about white people the way some women complain about men not letting them speak: SPEAK THE FUCK UP!
One experience that's foreign to me is being warned that when I turned forty my opinions and ideas would no longer be valued. That in company meetings, my opinion would be less valued once I passed my 'expiry date'. Well, that day has come and gone a *long* time ago and people hear me whether they want to or not. I *make* myself heard, sometimes to the point where people have legitimate reason to tell me the STFU for a moment :)
Black folks, like women, sometimes just need to speak the fuck up more. Stop telling me about what you're not 'allowed' to do, because I don't 'allow' men to tell me what to do or say.
And yeah, it wouldn't kill folks like Treecy to consider that their own experience is not necessarily everyone else's, and she sure as shit can't read white peoples' mind (mind reading is a skill a LOT of social justice warriors of all flavours seem to think they possess, LOL).
Just as we can't know what it feels like to be black, black folks can't know what it feels like to be white, especially white people who ARE aware there's a racism problem and aren't focused on preserving their privilege at the cost of others. It's why I have some sympathy for men, including white men, who are also a bit too beaten up sometimes by by feminism. Too many people telling them they suck no matter what they do just as some blacks do to whites.
Thanks, as always, Steve, for being a voice of reason.
"I learned about how some civil rights orgs in the '60s finally kicked the white folks out because they were doing exactly what she complained about."
Ah yes, absolutely. If we were still living in 1960 I'd completely agree with Treecy. In fact, there are a lot of things that I'd see very differently. But thank God, we're not! So today, I think we need to, as you so eloquently put it, SPEAK THE FUCK UP!😄
As I said to Treecy, the idea that minorities need "permission" to speak is no good, and it's an idea that whoever the "oppressors" are, be it men or white people or straight people, aren't going to dispel. We've become very good at look outwards for people to blame, but it's past time that some people looked at themselves too.